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  #1  
Old 18-04-2017, 11:42  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
BizkitBoy BizkitBoy is offline
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Question DVB-C TV tuner advice

Hi everyone,

I'm new to this and have a lot to learn, so please bare with me.

What I am seeking for purchase is a DVB-C TV tuner (preferably external) which can be connected to the PC and which can decode encrypted channels. The main reason for this is not only to just view TV channels on PC, but also to be able to cap different shows (probably using DVBviewer). So I will be using the coaxial cable and the CI card received from the cable provider.

By searching and also after a few recommendations received, I have concluded that what would best fit my needs is an external TV Tuner TBS 5881.
There's just something I don't understand about it. In product description it says that it supports both Free to Air channels and Pay TV channels which get decrypted by the CI card. On the other hand, there is a comment here which mentions that CI+ standard is not supported. To my knowledge, the difference between CI and CI+ cards was that the CI+ card decrypts encrypted channels... which is what this tv tuner is supposed to do based on their product description.

I'm confused regarding the capability of this product to decrypt encrypted channels. Of course I'm not expecting it to decrypt encrypted channels that are not part of my paid monthly cable subscription, but any other encrypted channels which are apart of my cable subscription and which can normally be viewed using the provider's STB... those I expect to be decrypted.

I would also like to know if using this tuner DVBviewer will losslessly cap both video and audio streams (including multi-channel Dolby Digital) without any transcoding being involved.

Thank you and if you have any other recommendations of TV tuners, I'm open to suggestions!
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  #2  
Old 20-04-2017, 05:47  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
MickeEst MickeEst is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BizkitBoy View Post
I don't understand about it. In product description it says that it supports both Free to Air channels and Pay TV channels which get decrypted by the CI card. On the other hand, there is a comment here which mentions that CI+ standard is not supported. To my knowledge, the difference between CI and CI+ cards was that the CI+ card decrypts encrypted channels... which is what this tv tuner is supposed to do based on their product description.
CI is the first edition of decrypting module, in where you can insert the card given by the provider. This TBS product can work with these.

CI+ is newer edition and it has couple of extra layers inside to protect against illegal viewing (e. g. sharing). Firstly the module has to be matched with viewing card and secondly that module has to be matched with your TV-set or digital set top box.

It means that your neighbours card won't work with your card module and/or TV and your card with your module won't work with your neighbours TV-set.

This TBS card has NO support for that linking procedure and therefore it is not going to work with channels which are encrypted with CI+ enabled encryption. That CI+ module is still able to decrypt channels encrypted with older CI standard if your operator carries both, example SD-channels are encrypted with CI and HD-channels are encrypted with CI+. Then your TBS-card with suitable CI/CI+ module and viewing card can open SD-channels, but no HD-channels.

You have to ask your cable operator, do they use CI (you will get a card and a module, stick them into CI-slot and can start enjoying the channels) or CI+ (you will get a card and a module, you have to tell the customer support your TV-set/STB serial number, stick the card and module into CI+slot and link them together, only after that is successful you can start enjoying the channels).


Quote:
Originally Posted by BizkitBoy View Post
the difference between CI and CI+ cards
Card - plastic sheet with golden contacts at one side

MODULE (can be CI -module or CI+ -module) - that metallic case where you put the viewing card into.
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Old 20-04-2017, 06:39  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
Rickk Rickk is online now
 
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there is no pc card with ci + slot
here must be purchased by the manufacturer a license as the most used cards pairing (married card with ci + module)
this is a big problem for many htpc users, since none wants to use the original boxes and ci + module only runs in certified hardware
ci + software alternatives are currently only available for e2 boxes, maybe what comes for pc cards
however, these are not an original certificate and could be deactivated by the tv provider
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Old 20-04-2017, 08:50  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
BizkitBoy BizkitBoy is offline
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Thanks for the detailed explanation!
What I can say for certain is that I do intend to obtain the card together with the CAM module from my provider, so they will be paired, no trouble there.
It is however a CAM CI+ module which I know for certain that it uses Nagravision, not sure if 3 or not.
Provider is UPC Romania.

Based on google searches I've found that UPC Cablecom work with SmarDTV which use Conax SmarCAM-3 Nagravision modules. I can only presume the Romanian provider does the same.

A TBS 5980 tuner has been tested with Nagravision, but paired with a Cifrowy Polsat CAM module, as stated here. Also many other Conax modules, but none with Nagravision.
I know that's a DVB-S2 card, but being the same brand, the same should probably apply to their DVB-C.
The only thing is that it's mentioned on their website that Cifrowy Polsat CAM module is compatible with both CI and CI+, despite being advertised as a CI+ module.

So I don't know... I guess I'll just have to try my luck with this tuner and hope it works to decrypt PayTV channels included in my monthly subscription

Last edited by BizkitBoy; 20-04-2017 at 08:54..
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Old 20-04-2017, 09:27  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
BizkitBoy BizkitBoy is offline
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I can't edit my above post, but just found confirmation that it indeed is a SmarCAM-3 with Nagravision. See Picture

Also, Wikipedia says here that Cyfrowy Polsat uses Nagravision 3 cards, same as my UPC provider. However accurate that info is...
Maybe I have a chance...

Last edited by BizkitBoy; 20-04-2017 at 09:53..
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Old 21-04-2017, 15:20  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
Rickk Rickk is online now
 
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look here:
https://www.smardtv.com/sites/defaul...ra_Leaflet.pdf
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Old 03-05-2017, 09:20  Translate from English to Italian  Translate from English to French  Translate from English to German  Translate from English to Spanish  Translate from English to Dutch  Translate from English to Greek  Translate from English to Portuguese  Translate from English to Russian  Translate from English to Russian
BizkitBoy BizkitBoy is offline
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Long story short, I took the risk and bought the TBS5881 tuner... it doesn't work.
DVBViewer says the card is incompatible with the device and PayTV channels don't get decrypted.

Maybe if I point out exactly what my cable provider uses, you can offer me some advice.

MODULE (Conax):
Brand name: SmarCAM-3 UPC Romania
Part number: CI0311-UPR01 R1.2
Software version: 07.00.52.01.09
Hardware version: 01000102

CARD (Nagra Kudelski):
Project Name: SMARDTV_XXII
Smart Card version: DNASP142 RevG06
CA decoder software version: CAK6_D3 1.4.1.B1.5 1.1.0

I did also e-mail TBS about this and the only reply I got was: "For CI+ maybe you can have a look at unicam2 http://www.unicam2.to/"

What do they mean by this?
That if I buy a unicam or deltacam module and use it with my Nagra Kudelski card, then the tuner will decrypt my PayTV channels?
Tried searching for this, haven't really found info. All user manuals on that website are in German (which I don't speak).

A little help please... I really don't want to be using this tunner only for Free-to-Air channels.
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